I can't say I've ever written an article prompted by someone from a non-Orthodox Jewish movement, but once I heard this podcast episode (of "Search Engine"), I had to share my thoughts.
Rabbi Dr. Sam Leben's work on Chasidic Idealism does a lot of very useful work on "the God character". Well worth reading one of his essays or watching one of his lectures on it
>>without making the point about God being an “unappealing character,” which, in my view, is both disrespectful to God and a counterproductive educational strategy.
Interestingly, I personally think it's an excellent educational strategy. Probably because I spent five years teaching Bamidbar and fielded that specific question about God every time. Acknowleding explicitly that this IS the emotional experience of people reading the stories of Kivros Hataiva and the mageifa Pinchas stopped and the mageifa after Korach etc
I think there's a difference between using people's natural reactions to God in the narrative as a starting point for analysis vs. a teacher FRAMING God from the get-go in a negative manner. (Zvika actually went on at length to say even more negative things about God, which I didn't have room to include in the article, and which I felt conflicted about including anyway.)
Methodologically, I've seen teachers make this mistake before: anticipating a negative reaction to something on the part of the students, and then PRESENTING it to them לכתחילה in this negative light in a manner that's overkill.
I'm not saying that this is an intrinsically bad move - only that it should be used judiciously.
Regarding your question about R' Yosef Karo, the GRA, and others: I am totally comfortable shrugging my shoulders, being דן לכף זכות, and saying, "I don't know what they held because I haven't learned their views on these matters, nor am I a kabbalist, but I'm going to assume it was not heretical until proven otherwise." I tend to agree with your statement that "the error lies with modern chassidism and mystics, etc." but I'm uncertain as to when this error originated.
I like your assessment of modern atheists vs. mesorah-based thinkers, and even though your conclusion that "Zvika is an atheist" is a possibility, I'm disinclined to think that, simply because he agreed to be interviewed for a podcast episode about what it feels like to believe in God. Although it's possible he might be lying to himself (as is always possible for us humans), I have no reason to suspect that he lied to PJ Vogt and all the Search Engine listeners.
I did not write in my article that I disagreed with particular chachamim. I wrote:
"The belief that 'everything is God' is pantheism, not monotheism. The God I worship is not a pantheistic deity. But can this notion of God be found in traditional Jewish sources? Yes: in the writings of Kabbalah, Chasidus, and other brands of Jewish mysticism. I think these teachings are wrong on this score and reflect a distorted idea of authentic Jewish theology."
In your first comment, you wrote that you don't think R' Yosef Karo et al. actually held by a pantheistic deity, and while that may be true, their worldview was still influenced by their respective sets of kabbalistic teachings - and KABBALAH (in an intentionally broad sense) is what I avoid. Why? For reasons too involved to elaborate on here - six reasons, to be precise. (I actually gave a shiur called, "Six Questions Which Prevent Me From Learning Kabbalah" or "Six Reasons Why Kabbalah is Sketchy" or something like that, but it was before I started uploading my Torah content and I can't locate the recording; I think it might be on my backup drive in NY.) And it's not JUST that I find Kabbalistic teachings sketchy for these six reasons; it's also because I believe the premature study of Kabbalah (or the study of counterfeit Kabbalah) to be hazardous, based on the teachings of the Rishonim and based on my own exposure. I realize this response raises many more questions than it answers, but since you asked, I felt like I at least had to state where I'm coming from.
Regarding your point about Zvika: got it. Thanks for clarifying!
Rabbi Dr. Sam Leben's work on Chasidic Idealism does a lot of very useful work on "the God character". Well worth reading one of his essays or watching one of his lectures on it
Intriguing! Thanks!
Great article!
Thanks! And thanks for reading!
>>without making the point about God being an “unappealing character,” which, in my view, is both disrespectful to God and a counterproductive educational strategy.
Interestingly, I personally think it's an excellent educational strategy. Probably because I spent five years teaching Bamidbar and fielded that specific question about God every time. Acknowleding explicitly that this IS the emotional experience of people reading the stories of Kivros Hataiva and the mageifa Pinchas stopped and the mageifa after Korach etc
I think there's a difference between using people's natural reactions to God in the narrative as a starting point for analysis vs. a teacher FRAMING God from the get-go in a negative manner. (Zvika actually went on at length to say even more negative things about God, which I didn't have room to include in the article, and which I felt conflicted about including anyway.)
Methodologically, I've seen teachers make this mistake before: anticipating a negative reaction to something on the part of the students, and then PRESENTING it to them לכתחילה in this negative light in a manner that's overkill.
I'm not saying that this is an intrinsically bad move - only that it should be used judiciously.
Thank you for the thoughtful comment!
Regarding your question about R' Yosef Karo, the GRA, and others: I am totally comfortable shrugging my shoulders, being דן לכף זכות, and saying, "I don't know what they held because I haven't learned their views on these matters, nor am I a kabbalist, but I'm going to assume it was not heretical until proven otherwise." I tend to agree with your statement that "the error lies with modern chassidism and mystics, etc." but I'm uncertain as to when this error originated.
I like your assessment of modern atheists vs. mesorah-based thinkers, and even though your conclusion that "Zvika is an atheist" is a possibility, I'm disinclined to think that, simply because he agreed to be interviewed for a podcast episode about what it feels like to believe in God. Although it's possible he might be lying to himself (as is always possible for us humans), I have no reason to suspect that he lied to PJ Vogt and all the Search Engine listeners.
I did not write in my article that I disagreed with particular chachamim. I wrote:
"The belief that 'everything is God' is pantheism, not monotheism. The God I worship is not a pantheistic deity. But can this notion of God be found in traditional Jewish sources? Yes: in the writings of Kabbalah, Chasidus, and other brands of Jewish mysticism. I think these teachings are wrong on this score and reflect a distorted idea of authentic Jewish theology."
In your first comment, you wrote that you don't think R' Yosef Karo et al. actually held by a pantheistic deity, and while that may be true, their worldview was still influenced by their respective sets of kabbalistic teachings - and KABBALAH (in an intentionally broad sense) is what I avoid. Why? For reasons too involved to elaborate on here - six reasons, to be precise. (I actually gave a shiur called, "Six Questions Which Prevent Me From Learning Kabbalah" or "Six Reasons Why Kabbalah is Sketchy" or something like that, but it was before I started uploading my Torah content and I can't locate the recording; I think it might be on my backup drive in NY.) And it's not JUST that I find Kabbalistic teachings sketchy for these six reasons; it's also because I believe the premature study of Kabbalah (or the study of counterfeit Kabbalah) to be hazardous, based on the teachings of the Rishonim and based on my own exposure. I realize this response raises many more questions than it answers, but since you asked, I felt like I at least had to state where I'm coming from.
Regarding your point about Zvika: got it. Thanks for clarifying!